The Israelo/Palestinian non-sense

If all members of this forum were born after WW2, I am sure there is not a single day in your life when you didn't hear about Israel vs it's neighbours.
Israel's creation was the resolution #1 of the UN, as it seemed that at the end of ww2, the jews needed a country that specifically protected jews (so, jewish state religion). The UN chose the original land on which Judaism appeared (or is it some sort of promised land?) and created a country from scratch on it.
Problem:
-2 other religions started on this land, and they happen to be Christianity and Islam, the two largest religions on earth.
-There was already a country on that land.
-This land has always been involved in conflicts, but for once it was actually doing fine.

Situation before UN intervention: things were calm, and despite the crusades, all were welcome. Situation after UN intervention: War. and it's still raging.
The situation today: Israel is a country with state religion which has WMDs at it's disposal and is currently 'illegally' occupying some parts of Palestine. It's ennemies are pretty much powerless and make (through unofficial militias) use of guerilla tactics against this powerful nation backed by other powerful nations.

So, I'm not asking you how we possibly could stop the non-sense because it's probably impossible anyways, I am asking you what do you feel (after reading this) should be done about this, as WE (well, our grand parents) are directly responsible for creating this situation.

The loss of life is very regrettable but surely a state has a reponsibility to defend their citizens.  The debate about who broke the ceasefire could go on forever and I can fully see Israel's reason for trying to stop rockets being fired at their towns.

What I can't understand is that if the Palestinians in Gaza for the first time in 38 years have autonomy why provoke your neighbour into another war and possible re-occupation?

Peaceful Warrior

I wasn't particularly going on about the recent events but about what has been going on over there ever since the creation of Israel. You say a state must protect its citizens and I agree. The citizens must protect themselves as well. If other countries were to take half of my country to give it to someone else for no particular reason (It's not as if the UN had given a bit of germany to the jews, or a bit of it's own countries), depriving me of my democratic right to decide of what happens on the land on which I was born, then I'd be launching missiles, shoes and dirty knickers at them everyday.
It's not about 'who broke the ceasefire' first (both sides are to blame for shooting towards the other). It's about finding a solution to a problem that was never sold (I'm referring to wars throughout history, gangs, mafias, etc).

Creating a country from scratch was a bit extreme. I'm looking for opposite non-violent just-as-extreme solutions. example: Dismantle all the countries involved and recreate a bigger one instead, with non-religious laws, generally looked-after by the UN. Saddam managed to do something similar in Iraq, surely we can do it even better. Except this could also lead to something similar to what happened in Yougoslavia.
Or dismantle Israel and recreate it somewhere less controversial, restoring the countries to their pre-UN intervention state. Or somewhat manage to convince all parties to live happily  and equally together. There is no reason why something that's good for a Palestinian can't be as good for an Israelite, etc.

[- Vergere -]

Israel gets what it deserves. I neither support, nor like the idea of a Jewish state, regardless of history.

We don't trust each other because we have weapons.
We have weapons because we don't trust each other.

We need a breaking ball to get some form of trust between the Israelly and Palestinian governments. Though both sides will need to sacrifice something in order to get back on the road of peace. Gaza is left in ruins so perhaps the UN lead by Israel and the United States could help rebuild Gaza. By putting in schools and getting to the Young people of that country that may one day be able to forgive one another the education that could

Israel has the capacity to be a great nation, IF they would put the past aside. There has been tribal/religious war for eons. Palastine needs to do the same.

I am not opposed to a Jewish state, but I am opposed to religious fundamentalism which leads to extremism. Jewish people aren't really known for extremism, but there has been much talk of one of the primary reasons for the hatred is not just the theft of land but the Jews trying to force their ideals on the Palastinians and vice-versa. For the love of the Force, its only beliefs! And nowhere in the Kabballa (dunno how to spell it) does it say anything about "Force thy views upon the people or they're damned." Quran, on the other hand, I haven't read. But they are both ancient ideologies which have parts that were only applicable during a time of tribal war. They must put aside childish things such as hatred due to beliefs and come together to form a peaceful solution.

And the US, as a primarily Christian country, needs to quit acting like Israel can do no wrong. I fully believe they attacked first, because the ceasefire was the first peaceful time the two countries have had in decades.

I am opposed to a Jewish state(especially one which is located where earth's two major religions originated). I am opposed to many things actually.... Christian states (like the US, though it's officious not official), muslim states (like Iran, but unlike Sadam's Iraq as some tend to believe), gay states, wheelchair-users states, etc... When you start separating and restricting people over fundamental things, you can't expect them to play nice together.

Jedi states are cool though 

I am opposed to a Jewish state(especially one which is located where earth's two major religions originated). I am opposed to many things actually.... Christian states (like the US, though it's officious not official), muslim states (like Iran, but unlike Sadam's Iraq as some tend to believe), gay states, wheelchair-users states, etc... When you start separating and restricting people over fundamental things, you can't expect them to play nice together.

*applause*
Indeed.  Agreed.

80% of the problem is the one country that support Israel with money and modern weapons.

Research the land they have seized since Israel started.  Today They've conquered far more than they were originally given.

Zionism is a political/religious movement that existed long before the 20th century.

Jews weren't just given a home just because of WW2.... Jewish elite in Britain and USA had been pushing zionism in political circles for years and years.

260 million Christians were killed in WW2....where's their special homeland?

80% of the problem is the one country that support Israel with money and modern weapons.

Research the land they have seized since Israel started.  Today They've conquered far more than they were originally given.

Zionism is a political/religious movement that existed long before the 20th century.

Jews weren't just given a home just because of WW2.... Jewish elite in Britain and USA had been pushing zionism in political circles for years and years.

260 million Christians were killed in WW2....where's their special homeland?

Very good point.

I think this says it all:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6RjnvQHWyLE

You're right. Even the Jews are against a Jewish state. And Israel due to its blind backing by US support groups is able to do as it wishes without anyone saying that its wrong. Even the Jews, who the land is supposed to be for, are against it...
It should be dismantled in accordance to both international human rights laws, Judaic religious law, and just plain common sense.

I don't know if that's possible. They have nuclear weapons after all, and I doubt the UN holds the keys for Israel. Also the fact that the creation of Israel is the UN's resolution #1 and turned out to be a massive mess does raise some questions.

I don't know if that's possible. They have nuclear weapons after all, and I doubt the UN holds the keys for Israel. Also the fact that the creation of Israel is the UN's resolution #1 and turned out to be a massive mess does raise some questions.

It is so wrong that they have nukes.

Personally my Country doesn't, and it annoys me that all these others do.     

We should not as Jedi choose sides nor condemn them, we are not aggressive but we must help those in need. And what we need in Israel and Palestine is understanding and rationalization of the situation. Israeli's need to back away from the Palestinian territories and leave them be. Israel has become just as bad as Nazi Germany by bombing the Gaza strip. Palestinians must accept the fact that the initial proposal of a Palestinian state is not rational anymore considering the geopolitical changes in the region for the last 40 years since the UN resolutions, and the Palestinians need to be a unified nation.